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 Hudson STEN MkII ... Cartridge Problem

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bjornhk
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PostSubject: Re: Hudson STEN MkII ... Cartridge Problem   Sat Jun 05, 2010 5:31 pm

Hi all,

I just got myself one of these Hudson Sten Mk. II's, but I have a major problem: It refuses to fire in automatic mode, neither full nor semi. The caps detonate, but the receiver is not pushed back at all. The cycling mechanism works fine when done manually, though.

Then I found Claymore's review:

Cerwyn wrote:
Post by Claymore
new model's barrel is blocked. The old model's barrel shroud (the metal vented hand gaurd around the barrel) is kept in place by 2 screws on the new model the shroud is threaded and screws to the body of the gun.

The new model also has a type of safety, the bolt cocking handle can be pushed in when the bolt is fully forward and this locks the bolt in place, the old model does not have this.

I realized that I might just have the old model; there's no safety mechanism on the cocking handle, there are two screws holding the shroud, and there seems to be a venting mechanism through the barrel.

However, I suspect the cartridges that were included to be for the new model. Can you guys determine this based on the pictures of my Sten?

http://bjorn.kleven.org/Hudson_Sten_1.jpg
http://bjorn.kleven.org/Hudson_Sten_2.jpg

Thank you,


Bjørn
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Cerwyn
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PostSubject: Re: Hudson STEN MkII ... Cartridge Problem   Sat Jun 05, 2010 6:29 pm

Hello bjorn,

Welcome to the forum

I'm certain one or more members here will give you a definate answer but in the meantime I'm wondering whether or not your cartridges are complete

I don't own an early Hudson modelgun that uses the type of cartridge you show in your photo but I think there should be a rubber 0-ring possibly fitted to the piston inside the cartridge. The 0-ring would seal in gas pressure generated by the ignited cap. This gas pressure is needed to blow the bolt back simulating firing.

This photo is from Francky's website (www.franckys-modelgun.com)

also, which caps are you using please

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PostSubject: Re: Hudson STEN MkII ... Cartridge Problem   Sat Jun 05, 2010 7:38 pm

Thanks Cerwyn ! :-)

I'm using Marushin 7mm caps (which, I was told, would work)

The lack of O-rings struck me as odd as well, so I used a hot glue gun to create a gas tight seal around the piston. Alas, the result was exactly the same.


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PostSubject: Re: Hudson STEN MkII ... Cartridge Problem   Sun Jun 06, 2010 9:34 am

Hi Bjorn

Marushin 7mm caps will certainly work in PFC cartridges.

I'm not sure hot glue is the answer to your problem. The piston inside the cartridge has to be able to slide easily in the cartridge bore while sealing gas pressure.

As I mentioned I don't have any of the early Hudson cartridge models so can't be sure how these are loaded.

I have searched through our pages here and found these Hudson drawings:

http://mp40modelguns.forumotion.net/modelgun-instructions-f10/wanted-sten-mk2-parts-list-t1628.htm

Click on the thumbnail photos for larger images. Page 1 shows a cartridge in cross section. I'm confident one of our colleagues here will show us exactly how to load these up.

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PostSubject: Re: Hudson STEN MkII ... Cartridge Problem   Thu Jun 10, 2010 9:03 am

That link is just what i needed! I don't think the piston in the cartridge illustration in the link looks at all like the ones I've got, so I assume this where the problem lies.

Thanks again, Cerwyn!


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PostSubject: Re: Hudson STEN MkII ... Cartridge Problem   Thu Jun 10, 2010 9:45 am

It's my pleasure Bjorn,

Maybe you could post up a photograph of your existing cartridge laid out to show every component part? That would indicate if any parts are missing.

All we need now is the correct loading method plus advice regarding the correct cartridge type for your Sten.

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PostSubject: Re: Hudson STEN MkII ... Cartridge Problem   Thu Jun 10, 2010 10:10 am

Cerwyn wrote:
It's my pleasure Bjorn,

Maybe you could post up a photograph of your existing cartridge laid out to show every component part? That would indicate if any parts are missing.

You can see them here:

http://bjorn.kleven.org/Hudson_Sten_1.jpg

The cartridge parts you can see are all the parts that were included (front, back, piston).

I am thinking of trying to convert it to fire Marushin cartridges though, if possible. We've got a couple of MP40's, and quite a few cartridges. It would be nice not having to stock up on two different types.

Does anyone know if this is doable?

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PostSubject: Re: Hudson STEN MkII ... Cartridge Problem   Thu Jun 10, 2010 10:57 am

Hi Bjorn,

I don't know for certain , BUT your Hudson Sten cartridge internals look very similar to the old Hudson AK47 layout. This photo was kindly posted by DOC

Smootik added
Quote :
Remove the piston and install a plastic O-ring on the lower part of piston (making sure the smaller side of the O-ring goes on the piston) then apply light lubricant to the O-ring and put the piston back into the shell nose making sure the O-ring is flush with the threaded end of the shell.




Note also DOC pointed out that the AK cartridge uses 1 x 5mm cap PLUS 1 x 7mm cap

The STEN may only need one single 7mm cap as it shouldn't need as much power to blow the bolt back

Conversion to Marushin's MP40/UZI cartridge may well be possible. You may need to make a new Detonator Pin for the chamber to suit Marushin's layout though. Check also that the Hudson bolt and extractor will grip the Marushin cartridge's rim securely. If not, you may need to modify or make a new extractor that'll clip into the rim groove.

Other possible cartridges could be KSC 9mm Luger. Detonator Pin and Bolt/Extractor could need modifying though.



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PostSubject: Re: Hudson STEN MkII ... Cartridge Problem   Thu Jun 10, 2010 2:14 pm

Old Sten type



for an easy life bin them and start with the new PFC cartridges


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PostSubject: Re: Hudson STEN MkII ... Cartridge Problem   Thu Jun 10, 2010 4:27 pm

DOC wrote:
Old Sten type



for an easy life bin them and start with the new PFC cartridges


DOC

Thanks DOC, I was hoping you would help out with this one. Some Hudson cartridges are becoming increasingly difficult to find following Hudson's closure. Assuming the Sten type will be as scarce is there another cartridge you can suggest that would work well

The good old reliable MGC P220s are almost impossible to find now, do you think Marushin MP40/UZI or KSC 9mm Luger might work please

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PostSubject: Re: Hudson STEN MkII ... Cartridge Problem   Thu Jun 10, 2010 5:54 pm

The KSC 9mm will work ok in an MGC MP40 so should work ok in the Sten too .

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PostSubject: Re: Hudson STEN MkII ... Cartridge Problem   Thu Jun 10, 2010 6:18 pm

DOC wrote:
The KSC 9mm will work ok in an MGC MP40 so should work ok in the Sten too .

DOC

Thanks DOC

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PostSubject: Re: Hudson STEN MkII ... Cartridge Problem   Wed Jun 16, 2010 6:02 pm

Hi Bjornhk,

Not sure if this helps scratch but I found a few rounds in my desk which I think are old Hudson .45s with an O-ring on the internal piston Very Happy similar to the ones in your sten should have. I did a quick measure and the MGC/Hudson (later style piston) O-rings will fit.



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