Interesting MP44 curio

Hi all,

Picked up a strange curio - would like someone with a Shoei MP44 to take a quick look at theirs so they can comment on a comparison with this one.

It is a "replica" MP44 - the upper receiver and mag housing is inscribed SMG Shoei, that and the barrel, front sight, etc are all finished in the same matte black paint that we are all familiar with in replica guns - I have an Fg42 , 1921 Tommy, AR15, UZI (here's a pic of the lovely FG) -


my curiosity was caught by this MP44 curio because:
1. The lower receiver which is not zinc (or pot metal), has truly original aged feel is marked "WaA 245" below a waffen bird on left above trigger guard, above well-aged wood grips.



2. The stock is marked "jvd" behind the trapdoor opening and "4274" in the wood underneath the cheek.

3. forestock, is marked below and close to the mag housing "aqr"


4. the magazine - phosphate finish, marked "chn" on floorplate outside and "jvd" on inside - on the follower, very vague "1vm" - on the mag itself "MP44" on one side and "1001" on the other.

https://2img.net/h/i127.photobucket.com/albums/p140/figaro1971/2011-09-13162352.jpg


If these are all replica parts and I'm mistaken, they are really very convincingly aged.

Thanks for any info. love the idea of finding archeology.

I will take it apart when I have time, I imagine looking inside the lower receiver would confirm whether that part was a replica or not.

Jesse.

pitfighter wrote:

1. The lower receiver which is not zinc (or pot metal), has truly original aged feel is marked "WaA 245" below a waffen bird on left above trigger guard, above well-aged wood grips.
2. The stock is marked "jvd" behind the trapdoor opening and "4274" in the wood underneath the cheek.
3. forestock, is marked below and close to the mag housing "aqr"
4. the magazine - phosphate finish, marked "chn" on floorplate outside and "jvd" on inside - on the follower, very vague "1vm" - on the mag itself "MP44" on one side and "1001" on the other.

1) there is also a serial number, just before "ac/44" marking, out of photo frame
2) jvd is code for Erste Nordbohmische Metallwarenfabrik Adolf Rossler, Niedereinsiedel, Sudetenland, who were stock plate subcontractor for Haenel.
3) aqr is code for Metallwaren- und Maschinenfabrik Lux, R&O, Lebenstein, Turingia, who were hand guard subcontractor.
4) mag floorplates were done by C R Ebert, Suhl, Turingia and C Hermann Nendel, Chemnitz, Saxony (codes unknown). "chn" is suspiciously close to the second factory name.

Other than that (info from "Sturmgewehr" book) I can't help much...

Hey thank you so much for the info. guys, that is awesome material, I have quite a lot of literature on the real MP44, but that is great stuff so thank you!

I pulled apart the internet apart looking for pics of the Shoei lower found some good clear ones on modelguns-worldwide, then decided to look for pics of the actual MP44 lower - confirming with very little doubt that this is a real lower.

I stayed up late and with curiosity (don't you love finding stuff like this?) disassembled the lower, and there are proofs and serial numbers all over the internals, and the trigger mechanism is 100% steel, for sure not die-cast.
(I will post some pics)
The text font and steel used in the Shoei handguards is also quite distinctly different to the originals, and they also use the same text font on their stocks - it is quite different to the WW2 German font.
The mag markings and material left me in little doubt about it's heritage - but very interesting to know it's East German.

So the fact remains - there is a good lot of Shoei MP44 parts somewhere, because this model is pretty much all original parts.

In this lot was an FG42, MGC AR15, Denix MP40, SSRoom MP40.
(Crappy cellphone pic)

Great find

If you want to look up some details, "Sturmgewehr" book is probably the best one:
http://www.collectorgrade.com/bookshelf8.html

I can look up for you more details based on photos or other data.

Thank you, Smootik,

I will get to a more thorough disassembly of the MP44 later.

It is a keeper, as is the FG, and MP40 9mm, the others are not staying, so I'm listing them around the internet.
I do not have the space for a modelgun armory, lol.

I wish the FG was made of genuine parts, too, lol.

Thank you again,

Jesse.

Here are some pics of the lower receiver - not sure what the story is.

It appears cosmetically very different to the Shoei replica receivers.
The modelgun company also uses a text font that is quite dissimilar to the WW2 font.

These were also posted on a WW2 weapon collectors site, lots of interesting opinions.
Most seem to think it is a replica Shoei receiver and barrel "dressed up" with original parts.

I did a cursory search on gunbroker.com for prices for these parts, this combo looks to be more valuable than any of my real steel registered pre-ban assault weapons that i thought were overpriced, lol .

Thanks for your input guys,

Jesse.

Smootik,

The serial number on the mag housing is part of the upper receiver, in this case that is the Shoei made "pot metal" one, so the serial number is one of their invention.
*BTW - the upper receiver is considered "the firearm" in the US, as you probably know.
We can buy Machine Gun receivers, but they must be saw cut three times with a specific amount of metal missing from the three cuts. Or 80% complete, meaning unopened cocking slot, unfinished milling, etc.

So the general consensus is just what you figured Cerwyn,
Replica receiver and barrel, with original WW2 fore-handguard, lower receiver trigger group, wood stock, mag.
I am thrilled, this one is going into the collection.

From another site: "Looks legit to me. From a 'X' block rifle which would have been a Haenel (FXO) 45 dated MP44 or STG44."

Signing out,

Johnson.

Duh, I totally confused myself with upper/lower/trigger group.
I thought that whole receiver is banned in US and was puzzled why real part could be used there at all.

Thanks for clarifications

Hand's Up for me - I always thought only what the pic shows here are considered / registered as "firearm" in the US (apart from the sear - other parts incl. upper receiver / barrel / stock are considered as replacmant parts)



Also:
http://www.westernfirearms.com/wfc/hkmp5?set=52&sz=1345x639
http://www.westernfirearms.com/wfc/hkmp5?set=58&sz=1345x639

edit.

Jesse.

You can buy the trigger group without a license in the US.
You can but any part of any gun except the receiver, without a license, in most states.

*Except the AR15 series of weapons, where the trigger group is the receiver, confused yet?

Is the case of the HK (semi-automatic) this is the part (the receiver) that needs to be transferred:
http://www.pooshka.com/a.php?aid=12952

You can but parts kits of dozens of different types of machine guns or grenade launchers, as long as the receiver is destroyed or missing, there is a strict definition to what constitutes being destroyed.
Just check gunbroker under "parts kit" or "cut receiver"
(for fun hit NFA Class 3)

http://www.gunbroker.com


Jesse.

Getting so goddamn complicated (US law that is) ...but thanks Jesse ...