VCRA

Post by Doc

oh, our animal rights people will firebomb your house and car

them quoting .... "Animal liberation is a fierce struggle that demands total commitment. There will be injuries and possibly deaths on both sides. That is sad but certain."

go figure .... although the penalty for this should be experimentation on them perhaps

DOC
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We need guns...lots of guns....

.... well anything mechanical that can kill people is interesting ...

Post by Doc (Dec 13, 2007)

oh and just when you thought it could not get any worse .....

They are adding Japanese Samurai type swords onto the offensive weapon list come next April ...basically means you wont be allowed to buy one .

Exemptions will be martial arts practitioners .

basically this will cover any 30cm single edged bladed weapon .

claymores.. broadswords will still be fine because naturally something with two sharp edges is safer than something with one ...yes really

apparently this is purely because of one or two cases where baddies have used them for crime ....

next they are going to ban men with "hate" tattooed on their knuckles ..exemption if you always wear latex gloves ......

anyhow I`ve bought both my kids toy guns for christmas ...and they fire darts and eject shells ........ so the PC brigade can kiss my

DOC
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We need guns...lots of guns....

.... well anything mechanical that can kill people is interesting ...

Post by Spencerman

figaro wrote:

Unfortunately she like many of her associates didn't want to listen, they have their manifesto, and it's set in stone.
And they will win, they always do, because even the most pro-gun of politicians has a wife at home.
PS. I love my wife.

How can these people possibly have any form of opinion about what they are talking about (or not talking about as the case is) when they are not prepared to even listen to the other side of the argument? I have listened to Mike on a couple of occasions, and apart from the fact that I am pro gun, I find much of what he has to say very interesting. He looks at the practical side of things, and would probably admit that although it would be damn fine to have a vulcan cannon tucked away under your bed ready for the next dirty old scumbag that wants to break into your farmhouse, it is also somewhat overkill (though very fitting for them, and fun). That sort of gun obviously has its military potential, and could be great fun at the right sort of range, but realisticly has no real use for any normal shooter to hold one at home. I would love one, just so that I had one, but I could never use it properly, it is too destructive, so why would I need one? However, I enjoy a sport. I consider myself to be a very good sportsman, despite my somewhat rotund figure. The sport that I enjoy is that of target shooting. I do not hunt, although I have in my past, but I do not anymore. I like to shoot paper targets. I like to shoot metal targets. I love to shoot clay targets. How does that make me a bad person?? The argument that they put across is wrong, because it is tantamount to raciscm. It is like saying that I dont like Iraqi people because they are Iraqi. There may be certain elemants or groups that I dont like, but I cannot hold every law abiding Iraqi to judgement because of the misguided actions of a few. Yes it is true that there have been incidents with legally held firearms that have lead to a loss of life, and the majority of those have been people who didnt deserve it (unlike scum who break into houses and get buckshot in the back), but it is far more realistic to see that themajority of firearm incidents are involving illegal firearms, and firearm crime is just that, a crime. It is the crime and the criminals that need to be targeted, not the innocent. You do not ban everyone from driving because a few people speed, and there are more fatalities per year from that in the UK. By all means have thier bigotted opinion for all I care, but give the man the common decency to speak. I wouldnt be surprised if it was the hoddied chav kids of these uneducated and rude women that buy into the whole gangster rap shit and cause most of the problems anyway by carrying illegal firearms, knives etc, and go round selling and injecting drugs, smashing up peoples belongings and bashing little old ladies.

Post by figaro

I am interested to see the reasoning behind banning Samurai swords, could a UK brother post a link to an article perhaps?

I understand there have a been a number of complete morons who've gone on a meth induced "rampages," usually ending with them getting tasered, after a lot of shouting, but is there any other basis for the move?

Anyone who has practiced Iai, or kenjustsu for any time will confirm it's certainly not the simplest weapon to use effectively, intimidating yes. There's a great clip of an Australian police officer totally taking out a sword wielding thug using just a broom stick.

Probably like the nunchaku the sword owes it's UK reputation to urban myths and action movies. I think the UK attempted to ban nunchaku because of kung-fu movies in the 1980's.
In Japan (correct me if I'm wrong) it was outlawing folks from carrying swords that created the need for the nunchaku, or grain threshers to become weapons in the first place.

Interesting how it all goes around. Real assassins usually used a short sword (wakizashi) or a dagger (tanto) anyway!

IMHO--I wager more murders take place with kitchen knives than converted replica guns, samurai swords or switch blades together.
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www.thebutcher-movie.com

Post by Phobus

Just read on another website that Deactivated Weapons is the next target of UK Govt .

It seems to be in an advanced stage of implementation .

No doubt the GOVT is advised that these lumps of inert metal are " readily convertible " by a bloke down the pub with a pair of pliers and some pipe cleaners .

And THEY can be seen to be active in the control of gun crime

I bought my kid a toy gun that fires plastic darts and goes BANG Just to be as NONE PC as possible at this Festive TIME OF YEAR .

CARL.
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Marmite enthusiast

Last edited by Phobus on Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:43 pm; edited 1 time in total

Post by Spencerman

...any chance of more clarification on this one, as right from the outset deacts had an exemption from the vcr bill. Does this mean that they plan to introduce a new restriction to ban these, maybe by reclassification or something, or is it a review of the vcr farce?
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Post by Phobus

OK here we go :

Go to www.airgunbbs.co.uk

Type deacts into search and it is near the top .

Carl
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Marmite enthusiast

Post by GZ22

I found the article here:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/crime/article/0,,2224709,00.html

which says:

Now the Home Office is preparing to make it illegal to buy and import deactivated firearms. It follows written warnings from senior firearms intelligence officers that new gun laws have failed to protect the public. An officer told The Observer: 'Finally, we are hearing that the government is listening to our concerns over the current loophole in the law as regards deactivated guns.'

Also interesting is this:

http://www.cybershooters.org/PDFdocs/DGCA.PDF

Post by Spencerman



There was one point in that article that bothered me slightly, 'The Violent Crime Reduction Act 2006, which came into force in November last year, banned imitation firearms'. I thought that the vcr bill was introduced on October 1st 2007?
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Post by GZ22

The act came into force in 2005, but the specific section regarding RIF's was delayed due to ongoing debates about how far-reaching it would be.

This is a section from the Radio Five Live program Weekend News.

This clip is from the Sunday 27 May 2007 program and features David Penn from The British Shooting Sports Council & Gill Marshall Andrews from the GCN.

http://www.glossover.co.uk/rts/download/raido5Live-27May2007-Penn.wma

Post by Spencerman

And there was I thinking that that woman couldn't possible upset me anymore. I suggest that if you are easily offended that you stop reading now. How can she possibly say that she wants to make sports shooting MORE antisocial. It is a sport for fucks sake. Why not ban football because there has been more trouble at just one football match than there has ever been at any shooting event. How can teaching young people to handle firearms safely and responsibly be a problem? My nephew, in his younger years, picked up a model revolver that I had just finished building. I knew that he picked it up, I let him do it, I hadn't left it laying around or anything. He picked it up and proceeded to then point it at me. Straight away he was put in his place for that action. I know that it was only a model, it couldn't hurt me even if he smacked me over the head with it, but I responded as if it were a real firearm, probably due to me having been around guns for a while now. He will never do that again. Now he is responsible with firearms, not as a result of one little mistake, but from growing up around guns, knowing how to handle various guns, and being allowed access to guns. I am happy now to let him have the keys to my gun safe if he wanted (not that I probably would in reality) knowing that the first thing he would do is make sure that the gun is safe. Guns are no big deal to him now. Everything that that flappy cunny sack spouts out of her mouth contradicts itself anyway. She uses the whole 'because I said so' argument. If there is anything more stupid, it is saying that there are TWO, only TWO, incidents withing the last 25 years or so? that involved a person killing others with LEGALLY held guns, out of how many firearm incidents? She didn't state that did she. I know that Hungerford and Dunblane were unspeakable tragedies, but just how many gun crimes are we comparing these TWO incidents to? From what I have seen about Ryan, he should never have had any form of gun, and under todays current laws probably would never get one either. As for Hamilton, he should also never have had a firearm license, but even if he didn't, he had illegal guns anyway, so what would have been stopped? My parents are anti gun, they always have been. My dad has shot my guns, and he has no problem with me or my nephew shooting my guns. The only thing that he has a problem with, and I don't understand this myself, is having a gun in the house. He doesn't like having a gun in the house. My mum, although having never fired a gun, has always encouraged my dad to show an interest in what I do, even though he doesn't really want to do it. You should have seen how much he enjoys shooting when he does, he loves it. He then pretends that he didn't, but he did. He could take it or leave it though, whereas I love it. I had a video of me teaching my brother in law how to shoot properly with a HK, where my mum and niece were watching. You could hear my mum gasping in excitement with each reverberating shot, and at one point saying to my niece 'ohh, look at that gun!'. How is that a bad thing? I can honestly say, that if I were going to commit a gun crime, I would seriously like to shoot that horrible Ponsonby-Smythe woman, or whatever the whogivesafuck her name is. She really makes me angry because she is not prepared to even listen to a different opinion to hers. I would be happy to listen to ideas from anti gun people as to how they think gun control could work better, so long as they also listened to me as to why I may need my guns. If I need to clean or tune my gun, I would need to have it. if they then said that that was ok, but so long as the safe that the gun is kept in meets such and such a standard etc. then that too would be fine. I am not a criminal and I do not wish for my guns to get into criminal hands, but I am good at my sport, and I am not a criminal, but I am fed up with people like that fucking woman thinking that I am an easy target. I will stop shooting, if she stops speaking. Her speaking offends me beyond belief, so if she can manage to keep her fat flappy lips from releasing that verbal diarrhea of hers, then I shall lay my guns to rest, otherwise the only time my guns will be 6 foot under is long after she is first!
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Post by GZ22

Very succintly put my good man! It vexes me too, that she won't even entertain the viewpoint of anyone pro-gun.

Post by PAWNO (Dec 20, 2007)

lol. I read that one of the reasons they want deacts banned is because "with just a file, vice and a drill" you can reactivate a gun in under 4 seconds!!!!!! considering one of the things done to deactivate a gun is to file down the firing pin, I really don't see how a drill, file or a vice is going to do the job by themselves in reactivating anything. 4 seconds though! It would take more than that just to put the drill bit in!!!!!

I love stats like this......completely based on truth and compiled by experts.

Statistics have shown that statistics are bullshit.

In all honesty, I did find it bizarre to ban airsoft and PFC's purchases while leaving deacts legal. Out of the three, only deacts can be converted to fire a live round. I say "can", if you can't get hold of replacement parts or you can't fabricated them from durable enough material then your plum out of luck! and of course, only if you know what you are doing.
There's also the fact that deacts look more real than pfc's and airsoft's because they um ARE!

There's always some moron who's anger gets in the way of the truth.

Now that the VCRB has been fully (almost) implemented, just watch the gun crime plummet! Just like it has sinced they banned real firearms.

Next I hope they ban Boxing, football, racing, driving, mcdonalds, smoking, people having contact with other people, intercourse and of course alcohol because I believe individually they have caused expedentially more deaths than any real or replica gun ever has in this country (excluding wars).

I want Spencerman to be the Spokesman for MAT (Men Against Twats who speak utter shit about subjects they know nothing about).

amen
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Heckler loves the Koch

Post by Doc

I notice battle orders have added some radio buttons to their gun pages so you have to confirm your legal reason to purchase by clicking one before you go to checkout .

Surely a long established trader is not relying on just this to keep them out of clink

either that or you are supposed to request one dipped in a bucket of yellow paint !

anyone seen anything similar anywhere ?

DOC

p.s are light guns in silver or black restricted to sell now ??
I think someone made an MP5 one too
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We need guns...lots of guns....

.... well anything mechanical that can kill people is interesting ...

Post by Phobus

www.airgunbbs.co.uk

have banned the private sale of airsoft and blank firers recently Took them a while to get around to it though , and even then they seem to slip under the radar occasionally

Even tho, these models are not strictly speaking banned - just restricted .

Also a member was told to take a load of paintball guns off the for sale section even tho, I was at pains to point out these are unaffected by the VCR afaik and are still on open sale new by onecommando ( for instance )presumably pick up only ? All to no avail alas , and still many members on there are convinced that full - auto paintball is illegal ???

How can it be when they are on open UK sale ?

My new MP5 ( acquired off the bbs ) is semi auto only but it does,nt bother me too much as I can pretend its like the ones the UK Police use ( also semi only I understand ?? - at least pending the phasing in of the G 36 we see more of at the likes of at airports and stuff like that )

Hehehee ... even our FIREARMS POLICE can,t be trusted with full auto weapons ?? What does that tell you about this Country ?

Mind you can you blame them after the London Underground Police shooting of the Brazilian guy ? How many bullets would they have put in the poor bloke if they had SMGs ??

Anyway , back to my online search for a Samurai Sword !!

Thanks guys ,

CARL.
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Marmite enthusiast

Post by BRMoore (Dec 24, 2007)

"It follows written warnings from senior firearms intelligence officers that new gun laws have failed to protect the public."

So now they have had their fun making new laws, time to get rid of it? lol if only
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Owner of an M4 Commando. Tapco real steel stock fitted.

Post by GZ22 (Jan 07, 2008)

Arrgghh!!!

http://www.metro.co.uk/news/article.html?in_article_id=82518&in_page_id=34&in_a_source=

Post by Doc

" including a stabbing " well how exactly is getting rid of deacts going to help that ...this is what happens when we let women in politics ...apologies if we have any female members .

DOC
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We need guns...lots of guns....

.... well anything mechanical that can kill people is interesting ...

Post by Doc (Jan 14, 2008)

OK here is an update on import of modelguns since Oct.

As you may or may not know Im part of a large re-enactment group here in the UK , under this exemption I have imported some RIFS post Oct.

The first parcel was held up some 7 weeks while HMC poked about with them .
I was told this large delay was because they were "a bit understaffed" to cope (and I`d add the staff they do have ZERO knowledge on firearms so this does not help)
It appears there are almost no resident firearms experts there, so they have to wait until some chappie gets time to examine items.

After four weeks they contacted me to provide proof of my association with re-enactment and copies of my groups PLI etc ..this was easy to do as Im the secretary and chairman of the group now.
What was harder to do was send a response to another letter they sent me stating that they believed one of the items was an actual firearm and they requested date of manufacture and calibre etc.
Well, as we know these things are made to look realistic however several sheets of paperwork later including diagrams of how to disassemble etc convinced these people the item was ok but it took some doing .

I had suggested they send it to a forensic lab if unsure but they did point out that if they did it would be a very long time before it came back .

Anyhow long story short they finally shipped my groups items out to me..... but they must hire monkeys at HMC because everything looked as if it was re-wrapped by a primate and most of the protection was just yards of sellotape and then everything was just thrown together in one large box (they had mislaid the original bubble wrap and box)
needless to say a few items were damaged but it did all arrive so we can get members kitted out with stuff for this seasons shows.

I`ve just been on the phone to them about my latest parcel and once again they think one of the items is real and asked me to provide a firearms certificate for it so once again I am explaining where to look etc , ( Ironically I do have a firearms certificate for the gun this replica is a copy for )
In addition I have to supply full evidence of the purchase of these items inc postage costs so am really looking forward to that large VAT bill too
(yes they charge VAT on the shipping costs also)

One good thing to come out of it is that they do all know me down in Coventry now and this latest parcel has only been held up a few days so far

Out of all of this all I would say is that before anyone thinks of importing items , please ensure you have your evidence of legal reason to import at the ready and be prepared to provide proof that these are indeed not real . If you think in terms of explaining it to a checkout girl you`ll be about right .
(apologies if anyone knows checkout staff with college degrees)

DOC
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We need guns...lots of guns....

.... well anything mechanical that can kill people is interesting ...

Post by Doc (Jan 22.2008)

Oh nice to hear the Met are having a four week amnesty so people can hand in their replica guns now ..... My God ...its going to make people think they are illegal somehow ...they even urge peoples relatives/friends to hand in someone's replicas as " every replica gun handed in will be one less off the streets" a mate on another forum did actually point out that by suggesting this the coppers are saying its ok to take peoples possesions without consent ...i.e theft ...

Ok to go to your local airsoft shop smash a window and nick a load of RIFs then ...provided you hand most to the cops (and keep one or two) then they will probably give you some award for public safety .

someone please stop the world as Id like to get off now .

DOC

Edit : here you go

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23433408-details/500%2C000+fake+guns+a+month+reach+Britain/article.do

bit irresponsible of that idiot blair to point a gun towards the press isnt it ...then again maybe not
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We need guns...lots of guns....

.... well anything mechanical that can kill people is interesting ...

Post by Claymore

makes your blood boil doesnt it Doc, saw this on the news last night and wondered what they hell was going on as they made it sound as though the ownership of replicas was now illegal. Do you think that they may actually direct their efforts at the people who use guns for crime or just keep punishing the innocent.
Even with the vcr in place they are not happy what the hell else has to happen before they cant blame reps anymore the met commisoner dod not look happy or impressed though did he sort of looked like he was wondering what the hell he was doing there, does that say something i wonder

Post by Doc

Quite ironic he was there spouting about replicas considering the buck stopped with him regarding the murder of that poor Brazillian chap on the tube !

so let me get this right ... THEY dont want us to even own plastic replicas but THEY want the right to be able to shoot us on the spot if we look even a little bit shifty .......

Time for a revolution methinks .......someone bring madame guillotiene along

DOC
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We need guns...lots of guns....

.... well anything mechanical that can kill people is interesting ...

Oh Christ...

This is how easy we could end up in bother. I employ a small number of people at my home. Being this disabled, as most of you know, I need these folks to be here all the time so they help me with my hobbies too, including my pfc model and airsoft guns.
I've just spent the last 1/2hour having to defend myself against one of them armed with a copy of the Daily Mail. Same article, 500,000 imitation firearms brought in etc etc...

Exactly as DOC and Claymore were saying, this individual read the article and immediately jumped to the conclusion that I possess a variety of illegal guns.

Reading through the article line by bloody line it was obvious that certain quotes had been forgotten... "Some of them sold on LEGALLY" for instance... but as was said, the conclusion reached after reading the article was that my house is full of illegal guns...

Panic's over now, at least with this one, but what happens tomorrow when another one comes in? It might be the same argument again, or worse, one of them might decide to take the fucking lot into the nearest Police Station and hand them over like a good citizen.

I pity the poor sod whose own mother handed his collection of 19 replicas over... I bet he could kill her for that.

Although I keep all of mine well out of sight, the couple I have as wallhangers in my own little office in my own home will have to be locked away from the gaze of people I invite into my home now too... just in case.

Christ Almighty, it didn't help that Commisioner bloody Blair had an UZI in his hands either, just the model I'm writing up these Guides on now!

Similar thing happened about a year ago. We were watching a program about the "Real Texas Chainsaw Massacre", some nutcase had been let off after spending some time on Death Row. He ended up over here in the UK, under an alias, married, respected, got into a gun club, got into business as a Real Steel Firearms Dealer... yes really...
Anyway he was rumbled eventually but the Police raided his house and found an amount of guns hidden about his house, including a functioning Thompson Sub Machine Gun...

Imagine the scene, this comes on the TV at the exact moment I've got my MGC Thompson in bits on the coffee table being cleaned...

You could have heard a pin drop...

Cerwyn
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Hobby collector of mainly WW2 era uniforms, headgear, field equipment and replica weapons.

Post by Spencerman (Feb 19, 2008)

I dont really know where I wanted to post this, so feel free to move it if need be, but being British, I somehow found this rather fitting for myself and the fellow Brits here. Whilst listening to Radio 2 the other day, they played a song by Cat Stevens (of all people, who would have thought it!) that I had never heard before (not being old enough and all that), called Im Gonna Get Me A Gun. Boy how I was toe tapping along with that one. For any of you who missed it, or some of you who wouldnt have perhaps had the opportunity to have seen it, here is a link for you all to enjoy:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=T9dh6KlEv_I

It is somewhat catchy though, I warn you now, I was going aroung work for a few days singing Im Gonna Get Me A Gun, so god knows what the other people I work with must have thought, probably that I had a new model coming or something!
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Post by Spencerman

I was just wondering, as you do, what with all this vcr stuff about you are still allowed to buy replacement parts. How would that stand if, say you got a tm airsoft 1911, painted bright pink or whatever ludicrous colour the govt deems ok to have a gun now, and you want to change the slide and frame etc for a metal one. I know that technically you are able to do this and as such getting the parts is ok, but is it ok to import a set? If you were to get a barrel, slide and frame set, surely that looks exactly like a gun, as apart from all the internal gubbings that make it do anything, it is a whole gun. So, my question is how would this stand? Has anyone done it?
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