MUZZLE FLASH

Post by Claymore

That looks fantastic, but i would be very worried about the damage it would do to the gun, i dont think you could fire round after round with that much flash without problems.

Post by John

It may cause fire in small enclosure !
How about just putting some matches' powder instead of Magnesium inside the cartridge ? Anyone tried that ?

Post by Mark

I have fired small charges of the Magnsium/Marushin caps, the barrels/chambers show a little more residue than just firing with the MGC or Marushin caps, but no discernable damage. So, I think that there is little chance of actual damage.

Match powder/Magnsium? It might be worth a try!

Post by garyforce

hello all

i just purchased a MGC Thompson 1921 which im very happy with (thought now im out of pocket )

i was just browing through this forum and saw this about muzzle flashes an i thought 2 myself "oooo that sounds good"

after reading some of the messages posted do i read it right that all that is needed is "some" magnesium powder in the cartride and that will produce the flash from the muzzle ?

i am also wondering (because ive only just got it and not really had chance to look at my thompson in any detail) if the barrel is solid .. then surely muzzle flash is an impossibility anyway

if anyone has some answers to those id be grateful
Cheers
Gary

Post by Mark

Hi garyforce,

Welcome to the forums!

Unfortunately, the late model MGC Thompsons have a blockage at the barrels base by the chamber so, unless this blockage is removed no muzzle flash is possible.

Now, the early version of the MGC Thompson (with recessed allen-head screws on the receiver top) had an open barrel that allows muzzle flash and gasses to escape.

If, you could locate one of the early versions then the flash is possible but, the later versions blockage is not removeable as 1. it's too far down the barrel to drill for most drill bits to reach 2. it's a carbon steel block that's too hard to drill.

Post by garyforce

hi mark

cheers for that (by the way your website was one of the key convincing factors in my buying my thompson so cheers for that )

i didnt think id be able to do the muzzle flash and it doesnt really make a difference really at the end of the day.

i do however have a colt 1911 an now im wondering if i can try it with that

Post by Mark

Ah ha, so, that's what my sites for, modelgun sales!

That's great that more people are discovering modelguns as they can be quite entertaining to "play with" and they are quite addicting too..

Yes, you can do the trick with the 1911..

If you can get some really fine magnesium powder (the finer the better) the better the effect..

Post by garyforce

hahahaha

perhaps mark you should go into the model gun business for yourself.you certainly know your stuff

anyway, can you have a look at this link

http://www.kno3.com/product.asp?itemid=13

and tell me if you think that powder will do the job.

isit simply a matter of putting "sum" into the cartridge an pulling the trigger ?

-Gary

Post by Mark

Actually Gary, that thought has crossed my mind(going in to business for myself) but,I don't know, as I started this just to enjoy the modelgun hobby. But, I am thinking about it!

The powder that is shown in the link will do just fine and it will produce an excellent flash!

Ok, now, when you receive the powder, get some really thin foam packing material (the thinner the better) and using either the cartridge case mouth or a suitable cutter cut out some sealing disks out of the foam.

For the MGC/KSC cartridges: load the cartridge with the cap and then, load a small charge of magnesium into the cartridge just above the cap then seal it with the foam piece then add the "piston"that's it!

For the Marushin cartridges: prepare the case by placing the "piston" into the upper case and then add the cap. Then, place some powder at the case bottom and screw the case halves together. done!

Be sure to clean your modelgun(s) as soon as you are finished shooting!

Post by Illuminati

Wouldnt the foam melt when the magnesium burns? i know it burns very hot, so it'd prolly make a bit of a mess in the cart wouldnt it?

Post by Mark

The foam that I mention is extremely thin..So much so, that it would burn up completely when the cap set off the whole thing..

The Japanese do this, so I guess that it is ok..

Post by Mark

I have tried the magnesium in my MGC Beretta M9 and it worked ok, but I didnt have any pre-ground magnesium powder I was forced to shave/file a block of fire starter to obtain enough for my cartridges and it wasn't fine enough.

The flash was good but oblivously,not enough to really be impressive.

I use a hot water/baking soda/vingar solution to clean my cartridges, as it works well and is fast and it netralises any acid that attacks brass.Then, I blow-dry off the cartridges.

You can never have enough caps, cartridges and magazines! (or modelguns )

Post by radback

The problem with the magnesium powder is it makes the flash too white to be realistic.
I've heard charcoal powder is making yellow flame when burned.
Did anyone tried other kind of powder? (iron?)
_________________
Marushin M84 (broken)
MGC M16 Vietnam
and:



Shotgun wanted

Post by October

what kind of charcoal? the brickettes for a bbq grill? or something like a charcoal stick that an artist uses to draw with? i would imagine the finer the powder the better... if anyone finds out more about this, let me know and i'll try it and post pics...(i'll film it too)

Post by garyforce

i dont know october ....... curious myself........ but if i had to guess id say it mite b this stuff

http://www.kno3.com/product.asp?itemid=6&catid=34

which is the same site i found the magnesium powder on.

now admittedly my knowledge of chemistry is somewhat distant (goin back to secondary school now )

now i know magnesium will create sparks / flame ..but charcoal ..... not to sure ther ! :s
_________________
- Gary

Post by Mark



Ok, I think that you have to mix the Charcoal with the magnesium powder I don't have any idea what ratio to mix them however..

I think in combination with the charcoal powder the magesium burns with a yellow colored spark/flash.

Post by Mark

Well, it will be interesting to see the effect (if any) that the mix will provide.

Iron powder might work too but I would be careful with any mix of powder as it can increase the gas pressures..

Post by october

i put magnesium in the M725. nothing out the barrel, but a giant flash out the ejection port...i put the magnesium in between the cap and the top piston.

then i tried another cartidge, loaded it normal, then pushed the top piston in just a bit, put the powder on top of the piston, and screwed the top of the shell on, nothing...

Post by Mark

Hi october,

The Uzi (and the M16 series) uses a "off center" barrel. That is, Marushin made the chamber so it isn't in line with the barrel it uses a short "by-pass" (under the cover with the two screws) this arrangement usually doesn't allow sparks or much else through other than smoke.

Unless, the top plate is sealed with a gasget/sealer, most of the gasses will escape into the Uzi.

So, I simply sealed the plate on my Uzi and my M16's so the smoke didn't escape out of the handgaurds and the ejection port.

Post by october

my mgc m725 seems to not have an offset like you are talking about. i took it apart and you can look right through the barrel...

though i am wondering if the magnesium is what caused my 1911 to break? if the pressure in the cartidge is increased, that might slam the slide back too hard? could that have been the cause of it breaking? it seems like a weird place for it to break...maybe they cant take the increased pressure.

Post by Mark

Hi october, the MGC M725 doesn't have an off-set barrel like the Marushin M16's Only the Marushin modelguns like the Uzi and their M16 series as they are all metal..


I rather doubt that the magesium had anything to do with your .45 breakage problem..I think that the problem is the internal clearance cuts on both sides of the slide (for the firing pin "stop") these weaken the slide in this area.

And when the slide inertia reaches the rear most stop point and due to the abrupt stop that the slide endures, any heavy pieces in the slide can act as slide hammers if they are loose in any way..As the firing pin stop plate is cast zinc and is situated at the rear of the slide where the slides inertia would magnify the hammer effect considerably (imagine the acceleration of the slide and when it hits the stop point the firing pin stop is first being slammed forward towards the chamber and then it's being slammed to the rear suddenly in a few micro seconds) and if there is any weak points in the slides design they will show up.

So, in combination with the internal firing pin stop cuts in the rear of the slide, the somewhat brittle HW material, the zinc firing pin stop plate and the abrupt slide acceleration/deceleration the slide breaks...

Post by October

Quote :

I rather doubt that the magesium had anything to do with your .45 breakage problem..I think that the problem is the internal clearance cuts on both sides of the slide (for the firing pin "stop") these weaken the slide in this area.

then wouldnt that mean that they all would break under normal use?

Post by Mark

Well, yes and no, the standard ABS plastic slide takes the shock far better than the more brittle HW/ABS mix slide. Also, perhaps Marushin revised something on these HW government models that possibly weakens them..

Post by october

if thats the case then why would anyone buy the heavyweight guns?

Post by Mark

Well, I have 5 HW modelguns at the moment.. But, only one is a Marushin. I really think that it's not the HW material, it's the design of the modelgun itself that presents the problem..I think that Marushin is using the same design for the ABS government in the HW version...So, the problem that you are experiencing is probably a Marushin HW government model problem and not necessarily a HW problem in general...